NE Leaders and Tippets

[Mark Cahill]

I've been discussing leaders lately. I know from experience we're not all in agreement on the best leader arrangement to use in New England. So here's the question: What do you use?

[ruge13]

I change leaders depending on where I am and what I am fishing for. If I am pretty confident all I will see are schoolies I will only put a 6-10lb leader on. If I am out on flats I will use a light 10lb leader unless the water is stirred up and cloudy, then I will go higher. I fish mostly in and around Boston harbor where the water isn;t the clearest in the ocean so I can get away with using a heavier mono leader all the time. If I am going to be stripping near the bottom I will use a 20lb mono leader. I know this is heavey but with all the rocks and muscle beds I find that a heavier mono leader is a little more abraision resistant. I also don;t trust any of my knots other than an albright from leader to running line, so I use straight mono leaders. I go through them so fast I just use mono instead of Flouro for cost efectiveness. Flouro would increase the abraision resistance but don;t think i am really skilled enough to worry about weather the fish I am casting too can see my leader, I worry more about hooking my ears and casting over 30 ft.
another consideration for me is my lack of casting gracefulness. I find the heavier leaders don't knot up as much as the lighter leaders. I need all the help I can get

[notime]

I've switched from Mono to hand tied flourocarbon leaders. As a general rule I use 15 lb test at the end but it varies. I'm an hour+ away from the salt and have a daughter (another kid on the way-even less time to fish), so except for the fall season I average less than one outing per week. Therefore, for the number of times I fish each year, I don't worry too much about the cost of leaders anymore. I don't go through that many leaders, so I'd rather improve my chances when I do get to go out. After fly materials, gas, fly line, value of my time etc. spending $15 on a spool of flourocarbon that will last a season is a good value to me. At my current burn rate, I won't have to buy another spool until my pre-school daughter hits college. I am also lazy, so even if I hit of school of hungry bluefish I probably wouldn't bother shifting to a mono leader.

[ruge13]

yeah I knot them up beyond recognition just about every other cast it seems so I use the same mono for my spin setups as I do for the fly leader. I wish I could say the reason I didn't get fish was because of my leader...that'l be the day....

[AlderBrookFarm]

I used to just buy pre made leaders but then I got caught without enough on one trip, must have been the leader monster...a relative of the sock monster that eats one sock in the washer..so I robbed some regular mono off a spinning reel. Ever since then I've just tied my own. In the Keys all they used was fluorocarbon and after the battle I had with a tarpon I became sold on using it. I have read that fluoro weakens from the heat of tying knots much more than mono and that you should make sure it is well lubricated when you tighten a knot. I think the abrasion resistance makes flouro worth using over mono though.

[mdglaw]

Well I used to hand tie leaders out of Berkely Big game. Then I switched to Fluro tippets. Now I tie on 4 feet of fluro 20 pound and a clouser and leave it at that. With a sinking line you don't want a longer leader. I do not think the fish are bothered in Boston Harbor by 20 pound fluro, and it makes it easier to handle the fish at boatside, which makes it easier on the fish. Use too light a leader and you end up tiring the fish more.
mike

[titleguy]

I used to tie w/ Orvis Big Game or SST w/ Mason for a butt. I have since switched to all flourocarbon 44lb Butt, 33lb transition, 15lb tippet. If I am dredging 44LB butt w/ 20lb tippet. I have actually had good success w/ heavier fluoro as bite guard/shock tippets for snook, jacks, blues, spanish and other toothy critter. The 15lb did not hold up long to a king last week unfortunately.

[bluewatr]

I use climax 40lb mono for butt, 25-30lb for transition, and anywhere from 12-20lb flouro for end tippet. I will often use mono for end tippet too depending on water clarity. At night I don't usually bother with flouro. I make my leaders generally 8-9'. If I am going deep I go 4-5' max.

-mike

[ruge13]

this may seem like a dumb question but why use a shorter leader deep? The sink line is weighted, most fly's will sink pretty quick, at least ones you would use deep...so won't the whole terminal end sink regardless of leader length or is it for something else?

[Mark Cahill]

A couple of reasons:

1. Because it gets the fly deeper (see attached illustration). The line tends to "hinge" at the leader, hence a longer leader will not get down as deep.

2. Visibility drops as you get deeper, so you don't need as long a leader.

[bluewatr]

I go shorter because it gets the fly down FASTER and keeps the fly deep. Especially when using non weighted patterns such as deceivers. When fishing in a strong deep current a shorter tippet will especially help
Also increases strike sensitivity.

[Mark Cahill]

When your line is hinging with a longer leader, there is more slack that needs to come out of the line before you are able to feel a strike.

[ruge13]

thanks

[AndyF]

Another question on this topic: how much of a casting/presentation/other advantage is there really in deeper water to using a tapered leader (I haven't seen many under 7 feet) as opposed to taking say 4 feet of 16 pound tippet material and tying it directly to the line, or a few feet of 20 or 30 pound fluoro followed by a foot or so of tippet? Another question, is there any problem with cutting two feet off of a 7 1/2 foot tapered leader, tying a new loop and using that?

[AlderBrookFarm]

The shorter leader/tippet makes the fly turn over better too if you're using heavy (20/30lb) and heavy flies. No Andy, there's nothing wrong with lopping off the end of a tapered leader...you do it every time you tie on a new fly just not as much at a time usually.

[BobG]

i switched over to a clear, air-flo line a couple years back.
since that time, i've shortened up on my leaders.

i use 3' of 30lb mono, attached to 2' of 20lb mono.
works great. fly turns over easily, and the fish don't seem to mind the mono.

[kayaker]

With fast-sinking lines, very short two-piece leader is my workhorse: 30-pound-test butt, 12- or 15-pound-test monofilament tippet. Double surgeon's loop is the butt-to-tippet connection. I agree with earlier posts about the strength, simplicity, and versatility of this knot, especially when the tippet section is doubled with a spider hitch before tying the loop. For floating or intermediate lines with normal flies,I use a longer leader and often add a section of 20-pound test between butt and tippet. This simple and easy-to-tie setup for my home waters on Cape Ann. However, at the top of my to-do list: "Try flurocarbon."

[ekg]

I used to use Maxima brown mono. Now have switched to fluorocabon . Hand tied three section Loop to loop,
Super flex tieable wire for toothy critters. The trick with tying wire is to tighten the knot by pulling only on the tag end. No corkscrews that way. The rougher the water the shorter the leader. EKG

[bluewatr]

I use the brown climax (cheyeene I think it's called) exclusively in Salmon River in CT. Matches bottom perfectly and have noticed standard colors have less strikidge....

[RJ]

Mark & Ray - The pro I told you about on our walk-a-bout on N. Monomoy seldom uses a florocarbon tip. He hand ties most of his leaders from a product by Pro Bass Shops called Off Shore Angler "Tight Line". You can by it by the 1/4 pound for $4.99 a spool from 4# to 50#.

He said it is exceptionally tough and works very well in most northeastern fishing applications. It is made by a company called Suffolk for Pro Bass. His top section starts with a 5 foot section of 50# test and decreased accordingly to the smaller diameters. (Tippit # depends on the target species.)

I'm going to buy some and use it. I'll let you know how it turns out! (over?)

He said he was pointed to this product by one of the top pros in the business when he was fishing near Harker's Island two years ago.

I watched him cast all day long a week ago Tuesday when we fished So. Monomoy and he changed his flies at least 40 times and he kept downsizing his tippet end trying to get those big bass to bite. The line and leader turned over sweetly all day long.

See ya - :p

[Mark Cahill]

I'll have to grab some and give it a test.