"Hollow Flatwing"

[boarmountain]

I have combined Popovic's hollow fly w/ a few flatwing style feathers for more action.Worked well from the beach at Montauk this fall.

[osprey]

It is what Ken Abrames calls the September fly.
It has been a very productive fly for me when mullet are around. I like it in shades of blue/gray and gray as well. It also worked well on Snook in Mexico tied in sizws to represent finger Mullet.

[boarmountain]

No, it is not a september fly . This fly has 3 collars w/ a flatwing saddle tied over each. Ken's has one collar. This fly is tied w/ 3 "hollow fly " collars up the shank.

[osprey]

Sorry that is something Ken has been teaching his classes to do for years.
You can see it on the fly tying board on his site. John Kelsey has some flies there tied this way and I think that the september fly is one of them.
Is your fly an interpretation of something that already exists and you want credit for it or do want to give credit for it to Popovics?
BTW, on stripermoon.com is an announcement of free fly tying classes with Ken at the salt water edge this winter, it might be a good opportunity to find out how these flies are named.

[boarmountain]

As I've said before, I am a regular at stripermoon.com also.I am not trying to take credit for anything. Popovic's hollow fly is tied different . The collars are tied reverse , then folded back.Then I tied a saddle flat over that.
As far as the concept, someone on stripermoon brought it up months ago(not John Kelsey). I only took the idea and tied up some flies.
Johns patterns w/ multiple collars don't have saddles tied in over each collar, only at the tail. His collars are tied standard style.
Ken has a bunch of my pics, and said he will be posting them soon. If you didn't need a website to post pics on ken's site, I would be posting there as well.

[boarmountain]

P.S.
If I was close enough , I would go to Ken's tues night fishing as well as tying. But Liberty NY is around 4 hrs from RI.

[JonS]

Neat fly, I'll have to tie some up.

[boarmountain]

Thank you ,Jon.
Mike

[Salvy]

Mike once again some great work. As for the negative comments keep it all in perspective. It's comes with the territory when other so called experts start to feel the fire at thier feet !!!!


As for the post by Osprey, I know Mike personally and am one of his regular fishing partners. If there is one thing that he never does is try to take credit for other people innovations. Mike is a young guy who ties old school style with the utmost respect for the inovators of fly fishing, including Ken Abrams.

As for the Stripermoon site, is was an avid reader and participant of the site for a long time but left it just for the same reasons I am replying in Mike's defense. Any outside opinion differering from the so called "god" is immediately attacked by what I reffer to as the "Abams storm troppers. I've even seen guys like Bob Pop and Mark Sedotti ripped on that site for giving oppinions that differ from Kens. No disrespect ot Ken but take Mike's Abram's style flatwings and place it side by side with Ken's. Then try to pick...guess what you lose!!!!!!

Not bad for a guy who's only been Saltwater tieing for a little
over a year!!!!

[osprey]

Mike
No emotional investment here to disparage your work, I speak plain -- attribution is agood thing. Don Gapen tied the Muddler Minnow and if you spin or stack the hair-- deer elk or other--large head or small-- trim the collar or leave it long or do a dozen other things, to me it’s still a Muddler. If I hold up a September Fly next to yours they look the same. It looks well tied but the same, that’s all. Three years ago I took a class with KA and he spoke at length and suggested using multiple collars and multiple pillows to seat hackles up the hook shank. In my mind, especially on the short 254, it doesn’t change the premise of the pattern. It has been a very productive pattern for me, both here on stripers and in Mexico on snook.

I look forward to your future posting on both sites.

[osprey]

salvy
Normally I wouldn’t indulge your mean spirited silliness. However you take an undeserved swipe at a another website that represents a lot of good people, just as this site does. You do neither site any favors. Your words in quotes indicate a childish angst or some sense of rejection you feel, but that’s neither my or a websites fault. That doen’t cut it in the world of men son, and the reason it doesn’t cut it is the website you malign is up and running for everybody check out and see if what you say is true. A man chooses whether to be a whiner and a victim. That choice is yours and if you want to discuss that further pm or email me.

[David Churbuck]

All parties take a deep breath and walk away to your respective corners.

Mike (Boarmountain) is a valued contributor to R-T and has breathed alot of life into our fly tying forum, which I note with some pleasure, is rapidly becoming one of our most active forums here.

Ken Abrames is a friend to R-T. He and I share many of the same views about the commercialization of saltwater fly fishing, the rise of superstar egos, the overcompetitiveness of those egos, and the lockstep directions on the "right way to do this and the right way to do that."

We both agree the real issue is access to the shore.

So, if it's one collar or two, Peruvian Nose Hair Hackle or a Tiemzu 81204S number 2 hook .....

[Salvy]

Moderator, couldn't agree with you more. Issue over ...no harm.. no foul. Just an open forum for all to enjoy and learn from. My apologies to the parties involved.

[jswegel]

Great looking fly Boarmountain! I tied a flatwing with a hollow flye body this summer but never thought of putting a saddle at each bucktail ring. Great idea. It nicely compacts the fly giving a nice illusion of bulk without the bulk. Does that make sense?

Keep those great pictures coming.

[JonS]

I agree, lifes to short to nit pick. When I see that kind of stuff I don't even read it.

Shore access is very important. That's why I became a kayak fisherman. Its great increased my enjoyment in the NY metro area as it has opened up a ton of great fishing that I couldn't access before.

Tight lines and favorable winds to all.

[VAN]

I've got to ask what a hollow body is????

[VAN]

I've got to ask what a hollow body is??????????

[boarmountain]

It is the method in which the collars are tied to the hook. Bob Popovics named it that because if you look at the fly from behind, it looks "hollow". Go to aswf.org to see the tying instructions.

[VAN]

Wow, thanks for getting back so quick! And sorry for screwing up my post.
I have Pop Flies and thought I read it pretty well but I missed that point. I,ll look it up.
Thanks

[JonS]

the Hollow Fly came after the book so you didn't miss it.

[sage fly guy]

Man, I love a good old fashioned girly type hairpulling fight.


I put my money on Mr. Boarmountain.

I for one find his flies most interesting, never having seen them up close much less fished one. If he says he did it somewhat differently than Mr. Abrams I think it's just to point out that a different technique can add a new and improved twist to a already good fly.


OK time for round two; scratching & screaming.

[stevec]

nice work!
thanks for sharing!

[DavidS]

I'd be afraid to fish that fly. It's too nice to let some fish chew it up. Great work!!!!

[Roop]

Mike/ Boarmountain,

Great fly - great style!

[striblue]

Historically, the flat wing fly has been around way before KA popularized it.