Bonefishing newbie - A little help please?

[teflon_jones]

Hi, I'm a new member who's going to be in South Andros for 10 days in December and I want to do some fly fishing while I'm there. I've been doing freshwater for trout, panfish, bass, etc for about 15 years, so I have a decent amount of fly fishing experience, but none in saltwater. I want to bring my own equipment so I need to put a basic package together since I don't own any saltwater equipment right now. I'm going to get good equipment (Orvis or similar) so I'd like recommendations on rods/reels that will work well for bonefish and the other species I'm likely to find. Also, what flies are best, and anything else that'll help me land my first bonefish!

Thanks in advance!

[ruge13]

Don't know much about it myself, but Definately look back through the threads on this board and on the tackle board for Bonefish, and flats tackle. Lots of good discussion. Also, take a look in the fly tying forum for a Bonefish fly swap. Great info on flies, and techniques. Good luck!

http://reel-time.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35446

http://reel-time.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35650

Here are two to get you started...

[Smcdermott]

It seems like you have left yourself plenty of time to prepare. I am headed on my first trip in May and would suggest that you pick up Dick Brown's two books (one specifically on patterns and one on fishing in general). They are both very resonably priced and a wealth of information. The other book I would suggest is Kaufman's "Bonefishing" but it is expensive (awesome photography) and somewhat repetitive after reading Brown. On the equipment front I have heard it is best to use at least 8wts maybe 9 due to the size of the fish and likely hood of wind.

Sean

[LeeG]

If people catch on to this thread, I'm sure you'll get more opinions than you know what to do with. To keep this very simple and generic-8 or 9 wts are good to start. The general industry consensus seems to be 8wt. It's my preference, fwiw. Good, smooth drag systems are a must for the reel. Don't skimp here. Figure 200 yards of backing. 150 yards would work on most fish, 250 is better on big fish.

Floro tippet at a minimum 8-16 lb range depending on conditions, at 9 to 14'.

Floating lines-most companies have a bonefish taper.

As far as flies are concerned-see Dick Brown's books or Lefty's books. For my money, if you have a good selection of 8 or 10 standby flies-clousers, gotchas, charlies, horrors, puffs, bonefish specials, and snapping shrimp to start would take care of you most places, most of the time. My opinion, pattern isn't as important and presenting it correctly.

Good luck and have fun on the flats.

[David Churbuck]

Ditto on prior advice.
My $0.02:
1. Polarized shades. Good ones. Wrap arounds. I like amber, others like grey. Can't catch what you can't see.
2. Wading boots. If you're going to stalk the wily critters on foot, then you need decent boots. I use the Orvis low-cut ones. Don't be tempted to use flip flops or Tevas. The fine sand will grind the skin off your feet.
3. Fanny pack to hold flies, leaders, nippers, bottle of water, sunscreen, etc.
4. Practice casting short distances with a minimum number of false casts.
5. Flies. In the immortal words of Reel-Time Founder Thorne Sparkman: "Everything eats shrimp." Think pink. I'm a big fan of Pink Gotchas and Pink Crazy Charlies in the Bahamas.
6. Humility. Half the battle is learning how to see the fish. These fish are designed to be invisible. After you get your heart rate over 200 beats per minute casting to a boxfish, you'll understand. The other half of the battle is presentation and the strike. You have to watch the fish eat the fly and then strip strike. I pulled the fly out of the mouths of the first dozen fish I ever had a shot at.

[MarkZ]

Save some $ and get a Temple Fork 8 weight and spend the savings on a solid reel. They are a great value. If you want to upgrade later an extra rod is always a good idea when traveling. Don't forget tropical fly line.

[teflon_jones]

Save some $ and get a Temple Fork 8 weight and spend the savings on a solid reel. They are a great value. If you want to upgrade later an extra rod is always a good idea when traveling. Don't forget tropical fly line.

thanks everybody for the advice! what is tropical fly line???

[mrschapin]

Tropic line is stiffer than regular line--it won't get limp on you.

I don't have a ton of experience myself, but I want to re-emphasize one of David's points above: get yourself some flats booties. I tried to get away with Teva sneakers one time, and literally tore my feet to shreds. Blisters, and then sand rubbing in blisters rubbing against shoe. Not fun. Limped around for a couple of months after.

[SageBoy]

I would like to piggy back on one of the points already made and that was good polarized sunglasses. This is another area where you should not skimp. I learned this lesson myself. It's amazing the amount of money that is spent on good rods and reels to be able to sight fish, travel to exotic places that you have saved you hard earned money and then go and spend $10 on a pair of cheap sunglasses. (#$119) I personally picked up a pair of Costa Del Mar's (Amber) that I love and would not leave home without them.

Other colors to consider would be Vermillion for those foggy and low light conditions.

You can't catch what you can't see.

.02

Have Fun! I am hoping to make it down in April.

[Ryder]

..........

[Marshrunner]

If you are going to the Bahamas in December, practice casting into winds of 10+ mph ... higher if you can. And if you don't already do it, teach yourself to stripstrike. Adding to David's advice read everything you can find on spotting bonefish and all their different camouflage "looks." Then be patient and tenacious when you can't see them. Also tell your guide you've never bonefished and ask him to talk you through what he is seeing, as fish come into range, using the clock and distance system e.g. three fish coming left at 2 o'clock, 70 feet. Bow of boat is 12).

Finally, enjoy yourself even when it frustrates you--the reward is worth it when you hook up. Stay with it and you will.

Dick

[AlderBrookFarm]

Dave's post pretty much says it all. The added added info on sunglasses can't be beat either. All I can say is you get what you pay for. I superglued my glasses saver/croakie to the glasses, that way when something happens that would normally yank the glasses out of the holder they don't and they're still around your neck. Really didn't damage the glasses and if you don't overdo it you can break the bond to replace the holder. Also...for us older fisherpersons :brow ...I bought the 20/20 optics magnifiers that you wet and "stick" on the lens and they work real well. I think they were around $20 from Cabelas. To see if you're glasses are polarized hold two pair up, one horizontal and one vertical...if it's darker when they are in that position then they are polarized, if not then they aren't...go get polarized ones

[teflon_jones]

If you are going to the Bahamas in December, practice casting into winds of 10+ mph ... higher if you can. And if you don't already do it, teach yourself to stripstrike.
.............
Finally, enjoy yourself even when it frustrates you--the reward is worth it when you hook up. Stay with it and you will.


i'm not too worried about casting into 10+ mph winds. i can cast a DT4 line on an 7.5' ft pole 60 ft into a breeze while kneeling in a canoe! ;) i've done a lot of panfish and bass fishing so i'm used to setting the hook while moving the fly around. i assume that's what you mean by stripstrike. i'm not so good with flyfishing terms because i'm self taught and i don't really get into reading too much about it either! i'm too busy fishing! :)

frustration? what frustration? i can't ever recall getting frustrated while fly fishing, even last summer on a trip to the North Maine Woods, fishing in a canoe in the pouring rain for hours without even a strike. i was still happy to be there! --125-3

thanks again for all the advice! this is really invaluable.

i've been looking around at reels and found the ross reels canyon big game. the price is right ($345 from cabela's) and it holds 185 yds of 30 lb backing. anybody else using this reel? thoughts?

[Guy]

I'll second the TFO recommendation, I have both the Ti (pro series) and Lefty's TiCr series in 8 wt. The TFO's have relegated my Sage RPLX to the closet at home when I travel now!

Reels? The Ross Big game is a wonderful reel particualrily if you ever want to target other larger species such as tarpon. Not to steer you away but it is more than you need for bonefish. I have caught dozens of bones with an Orvis Battenkill 8/9 reel. They'll do the job nicely. The last three years I have been using an Lamson Velocity 3.5. It is a very smooth bonefish reel. I took an Okuma Integrity 10/11 with me on my last trip. This reel with an 11 wt TFO TiCR tamed about 2 dozen lemons and blacktip sharks from 4 - 7 feet long without a hitch. After that performance, I wouldn't hesitate trying the 8/9 Integrity for bonefish either!

Regarding footwear, I have settled on wearing nylon socks inside a pair of neoprene socks (I buy the cheap World Famous brand) for wading. On sand that will be all you need. If you want extra protection for rocks and coral, you can put on pair of surf slippers or canvas runners. The neo socks and surf slippers are very comfortable and will wear out after a couple of weeks of hard wear but they are cheap enough you can buy several pairs for the price of one flats bootie. Many Bahamian guides I have fished with do not like the flats booties. They claim they are too loud, spooking bonefish both when wading and in the boat. I do think the guides start looking for excuses sometimes when the fishing not up to expectations - might as well blame the dude and his footwear rather than the guide right? Anyways, the neo socks are as quiet as being barefoot and still provide protection and the guides won't be after you to leave the booties in your day bag or back at the dock!

Don't underestimate the wind. It's one thing to fish blind in a 20 knot wind, It's quite another to even find the gray ghost of the flats and then cast quickly and accurately at an awkward angle to a moving target that will likely disappear forever in less than three seconds! It wouldn't hurt to consider taking a nine wt rig along for the wind and / or the occasional shot at baracudas (and as back up if you break the 8wt).

Half the fun of going bonefishing is preparing for the trip!

Guy

[peanuts]

Can't fault what has already been said, Except get a good pair of boots & glasses, rods.reels & lines can be replaced, eyes & feet can't go for the Simms flats sneakers with their socks to keep the sand out of the boots.
If your Quick you might be able to pick up a pair for 1/2 price ie 50 bucks @ www.americanfly.com even if you don't get them there still get them you won't regret it.

[beaconhill]

I just got back from my first bonefishing trip - also to Andros. It was an extraordinary fishing/nature experience that exceeded my already very high expectations - this was true of all the guys I went with.

My thoughts regarding our equipment/flies, etc., etc.:

1. Before you even get to equipment, make sure that you are going to be fishing with a good guide. As has been stated in other posts, the fish are very, very difficult to spot consistently, especially at first, and a guide, I think, is essential.

2. As others have said, and pursuant to point #1, spend money on good polarized sunglasses - you will not see or catch fish without them.

3. I brought an 8 wt and a 9 wt rod, both with floating line, overlined by 1 (a 9 wt line on the 8 and a 10 wt line on the 9) no special bonefish taper. I used the 8 almost exclusively and it was fine. Keep in mind that on trips like this, and any time you're away from your home waters, rods break in a manner directly proportional to the inaccessability of replacement tackle (a variation of Murphy's Law). As you know, there ain't nothin' on Andros except nice people and fish, so bring an extra rod, extra lines, extra leaders, etc., etc.

4. I am a huge fan of the Tibor reels. Ridiculously expensive, maybe, but an investment for a lifetime of fishing, and you really need a sound, durable reel with an excellent drag mechanism, especially if you get into bigger bones. I purchased a Billy Pate anti-reverse reel (every trip is an opportunity for capital expenditures) and was thrilled with its performance.

5. Some folks said to get those dorky shin-high wading boots and to shun Tevas, etc. They're absolutely right - you have to keep the sand out and be comfortable. You can wade for miles (truly) and you cannot be uncomfortable while wading, or your trip will be spoiled.

6. Regarding flies: I tied a large number of different flies - clousers, gotchas, crazy charlies, crabs, etc. and fished almost exclusively with gotchas - pink, with tan craft fur, with plenty of flash. One thing regarding fly size: the pattern books kind of urge you to go small with your gotchas, and you should have small ones for low tide flats wading, but do tie some large ones, too, with barbell eyes instead of bead chain - the big fish/big flies thing seems to work here, and you really need to get the flies down quickly to big cruising fish.

That's my 2 cents on my recent virgin trip. Please feel free to send me a private message, and I'd be happy to spend some time on the phone with you about our trip.

[BobG]

Buy the dorky ankle high flats boots, and wear them. Wear them every minute you fish.

On my recent trip, I was forced to fish one full day without my flats boots. The neighborhood "island dog" ran off with one of my boots one evening (hilarious story), and it wasn't until the next day the boot was found.
However, the next day I wore a pair of heavy socks inside my Teva's. I still have scabs all over both feet and ankles. The combination of sand in the socks, and sand rubbing against the velcro straps tore me feet apart. My feet hurt the rest of the trip, and for a long time after.

You literally do walk for miles on the flats. The consistancy of the bottom changes all the time.

[n1gdo]

Guy...where do you buy the footwear you describe below...?
Any help appreciated.


Regarding footwear, I have settled on wearing nylon socks inside a pair of neoprene socks (I buy the cheap World Famous brand) for wading. On sand that will be all you need. If you want extra protection for rocks and coral, you can put on pair of surf slippers or canvas runners. The neo socks and surf slippers are very comfortable and will wear out after a couple of weeks of hard wear but they are cheap enough you can buy several pairs for the price of one flats bootie. Many Bahamian guides I have fished with do not like the flats booties.

[David Churbuck]

I swear by these Orvis low-top wading boots (http://www.orvis.com/store/product_choice.asp?pf_id=13XH&feature_id=&dir_id=758&group_id=777&cat_id=22&subcat_id=3&shop_id=). $35. I bought them a size too big and use them with a pair of Orvis lighweight breathable waders as well. They are very comfortable. I also own a pair of the Orvis "Christmas Island" boots, which are mid-shin and have a velcro strap to keep the sand out. Truth is -- sand gets into them anyway.

http://images.orvis.com/orvis_assets/prodimg/13XHG4SF.jpg (http://www.orvis.com/store/product_choice.asp?pf_id=13XH&feature_id=&dir_id=758&group_id=777&cat_id=22&subcat_id=3&shop_id=)

Here's the taller boots. (http://www.orvis.com/store/product_choice.asp?pf_id=03JQ60&feature_id=&dir_id=758&group_id=777&cat_id=22&subcat_id=3&shop_id=)

http://www.orvis.com/orvis_assets/prodimg/03JQ601.jpg

[beaconhill]

I bought the Hodgmans, I think from Bean, and they worked very well.

[MarkZ]

The Cabelas high tops I got look very similar to Orvis' and they have a velcro band you can cinch down to reduce the sand getting in.

[widdoes]

Even if you are doing mostly/solely boat fishing, avoid Teva's like the plague. Firstly, line on the deck has an insidious way of looping around that little tag end of velcro strap hanging from your Teva, so that when you try to shoot a cast at the trashcan-lid-sized permit feeding 60' away, you wind up unbuckling your shoes and having the cast come shooting at you instead. Also, and we've all been here, that first day out when you are lathering up the sunblock, but who bothers to get the tops of his feet? Talk about pain, and the beautiful criss-cross red and white patern on the tops of your feet will make you the "envy" of the lodge. --124-3
My set up is a St Croix Ultra Legend 9' 8wt and a Tioga #8 reel which I'm going to reload with a 9 wt "bonefish" line for this trip. I've had no problems with this equipment, and the whole kit was <$500.
And, get at least 2 pairs of glasses! One can be cheap spares, but have an extra. If you wear glasses, fit-overs suck.
-WJ

[David Churbuck]

Widdoes makes a great point about avoiding anything on your body which can snag a loop of fly line. Murphy's Law applies in a big way to stuff which will grab a fly line while casting to THE fish of your career.

Shirt cuff buttons, tag end of your belt, and especially shoe laces or velcro straps are all primary culprits.

Lefty Kreh has an awesome little book called 101 Fly-Fishing Tips (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1585740357/qid=1076609532/sr=2-1/ref=sr_2_1/102-6995442-7182527), in it he talks about how to "snag-proof" your boat shoes. First thing, take off the regular shoe laces and replace themwith a long strip of fabric-elastic -- which you can pick up at a drug store or sewing supply place. Lace the shoe back up with the big elastic band, tuck the knot under the lacing and not only do you have a laceless pair of shoes, they will quickly become the easiest on-off pair of shoes you own. My kids watched me convert all my sneakers to the Kreh method and are now convinced I am an old fool one step away from installing Clappers on all the lights or riding an electric Lark around the Stop & Shop.

But the fly line doesn't snag on my feet anymore.

[Vic T]

You said you don't like to read but if you are going to spend the $$$ for a trip to Andros, you would be very wise to buy both Randall Kaufmann' s book "Bonefishing" and well as Dick Brown's book "Flyfishing for Bonefish". Read them, use a yellow highlighter on critical info, take Dick's book on the trip (Kaufmann's is too large), and scan your highlighted notes before you go out in the morning. This system worked wonders for me on my first bonefishing trip. Both books will cost you about a total of $100 (about equal to 2 days' worth of tips for guides) and you'll learn so much you won't believe it.

It's like everything else in life ... do your homework and you'll get high scores.

[Guy]

[QUOTE=n1gdo]Guy...where do you buy the footwear you describe below...?
Any help appreciated.


n1gdo- I buy the neo socks here in Canada at a place caled Wholesale Sports. Cabellas carries neo socks as well in 2 and 3 mm for around $12 - $15. I buy my surf slippers when they are going "out of season" at Walmart for like $2-3 per pair, I have seen them normally for $5 - $7. I have found the canvas deck shoes there and at places like Payless Shoes.

I have spent nearly 10 weeks wading every day over 5 different trips in the Bahamas in recent years. Believe me this is a very comfortable arrangement. I have rather tender tootsies having lopped off the tips of a few toes on my right foot with a lawn mower, yet I can wade for days on end with my neo socks and surf shoes (if needed). For fishing the rocky coral Atlantic side coves and beaches I put on the deck shoes. A pair of lightweight nylon socks underneath it all is definitely needed to prevent chaffing. The key is to make sure every thing fits snuggly and you'll keep out sand and grit. On two recents trips to the Bahamas (Exumas and Long Island) my fishing buddies ended up using my extra neo socks and surf shoes by the end of the week instead of their own booties, one had Orvis high tops and the other a pair of Sims Flats booties.

Guy

[jjonas]

To me nothing feels better then being barefoot on a casting deck. I can feel if I am stepping on the line and it is just plain comfortable. For wading I got a pair of Simms booties, which I use with a pair of socks to buffer chafing from sand that always gets in there.

[JeffR]

T-jones,

Hope you don't take this the wrong way. You sound like my kind of flyfisherman - self taught, dedicated and out there for the total experience (#$121)

My number one piece of advice is: regardless of how much freshwater experience you might have, casting practice, casting practice, casting practice. It will pay off more than anything else.

My brother and I have been flyfishing since we were 10-12 (we're now 39-41), and like you, are competent casters. Before our trip to Andros a couple years ago, I spent six months, two days a week, practicing with my 8-weight. Despite my counsel, he didn't. I'll give you one guess who had more fun on the trip. I'll give you one more guess as to who wished he'd practiced more.

While there, our guide whose regular clientele includes some pretty serious sticks, rated my casting in the top 20 percentile - I think I suck! I figure that I can't consider myself reliable at 60 feet unless I can consistently put the fly into a 2-foot circle at 75-80 feet. That's with a head-wind, tail-wind, left-wind or right-wind, using my saltwater equipment, with a dumbell-eye weighted fly on the end, using no more than 3 false casts starting with the fly in my hand. Bonefishing is just a different game than freshwater, and I guarantee if you practice with the above goal, you will have done more than anything else you could do to ensure enjoyment of your trip.

Have a great one! I'm jealous because I won't be back there until May 05.

Jeff

[teflon_jones]

there's more good advice here than i know what to do with! (#$120)

i'll definitely be picking up a pair of wading shoes, the only problem is finding them in my size! i wear a 15 wide! it's hard enough finding regular shoes, never mind specialized shoes. anybody have any ideas? i looked on cabelas.com and they only go up to 13, and a couple of other places only go up to 14. :confused:

on a similar note, i've never bought waders because by the time they made them in my size (only available in the last 5 years or so), i had already figured out a different system. believe me, i get a lot of these (#$119) when i get out of my car and walk right into a 40 degree spring trout stream in my jeans. i just wear a pair of sweatpants underneath them for insulation and the jeans are pretty good at stopping water from flowing through them, so warm water gets trapped in the sweatpants against my skin. i can stay out fishing for hours with this system without a problem as long as i take breaks occassionally. plus, i wade fast streams and if you're wearing waders they produce a lot of drag, and if you step in a hole you can get in trouble if water goes over the top of them. so with my system i never worry about the depth of the water as long as it's not over my armpits. i just put anything i don't want to get wet under my hat!

jeff r, once i get my new rod i'll definitely be doing some practice casting, don't worry! i'm not THAT confident in my casting skills! ;)

the trip to south andros is for my honeymoon, and the other night my best man (a very avid sportsman) was having dinner with us and mentioned about seeing nurse sharks in the flats the couple of times he's been there and how he got a half a bonefish on the line a couple of times due to a hungry shark. of course my fiancee said "sharks? you're not going wading where there's sharks!!!!" i don't think she understands that ALL sharks don't attack humans!

i found a used Orvis DXR 7/8 wt. Fly Fishing Reel for sale. it comes with a spare spool too. any idea how much they are new? what would be a good price for this one in good condition?

[teflon_jones]

You said you don't like to read but if you are going to spend the $$$ for a trip to Andros, you would be very wise to buy both Randall Kaufmann' s book "Bonefishing" and well as Dick Brown's book "Flyfishing for Bonefish". Read them, use a yellow highlighter on critical info, take Dick's book on the trip (Kaufmann's is too large), and scan your highlighted notes before you go out in the morning. This system worked wonders for me on my first bonefishing trip. Both books will cost you about a total of $100 (about equal to 2 days' worth of tips for guides) and you'll learn so much you won't believe it.

It's like everything else in life ... do your homework and you'll get high scores.

probably good advice. :) i was thinking of buying a book or two, and i'll need reading material anyway because our resort is in the middle of nowhere (taking a seaplane to get to it!) so i'll have plenty of time to read on the beach between fishing trips! thanks for the recommendations on books too!

[Too Fly]

Rods/Reels: I typically bring an 8 wt. for 75% of the time and a 9 wt. for the very windy days. A reel with a good drag and about 200 yds. of dacron does the trick.

Wading Shoes: Don't make the mistake of wearing a low cut shoe. Even with the higher cuts(3/4 and up) you'll find that the sand magically appears in your shoe during and at the end of the day. I like the Patagonia Marlwalkers and Simms flats sneakers(kinda low cut). Though I found that the Marlwalkers were a little too narrow and offer no cushion. But they offer ankle support and good pretection from sand, coral, etc. The Simms Flats sneaks feel more like a sneaker and are very comfortable with an extra insole. Long, cushy socks are a good idea too. They offer some protection from bugs and can be folded over the tops of your shoes to help prevent sand from entering.

Shirts: Check out the quick drying technical flats shirts made by Patagonia, Ex-Officio, Columbia, etc. They've almost all got serious ventialtion, pockets and some have a UV repellent built into the fabric, etc. I found that on hot, sunny days that my back and upper arms got blistered. Sunscreen on the face, neck, arms, back, chest and anything that's exposed to the sun is a must. Bring a couple hats too.

Pants: Check out zip-off, quick drying, technical pants, which are made by most outdoor clothing companies(Pat., Ex, Col., North Face, etc.). They're great as shorts if the bugs aren't too bad.

Bugs: Beware of Doctor Flies! The're called Doctor flies because they draw blood. They look like a cross between a honey bee and horse fly...only they're kinda fuzzy and have huge blue/gray eyes. They keep to mangroves and shrubbery on the keys. Fortunately, they usually stay below knee level, unless you're sitting down. I got a bite on my hand once while sitting down. The guide couldn't believe the size of the chunk of skin that the fly took. If you feel a nasty sting on your legs or feet, it's too late. Be prepared for at least a week's worth of lousy slept nights of scratching swollen bites. My friend takes a pair of thick socks, cuts the feet off and pulls them over his calves. He says it protects him when the flies are low and concentrating on the wet pant leg adhering to his skin.

There's another nasty looking bug out there, but luckily they're after the Doctor flies. If you look every now and then by your knees, you might catch a dog fight between the unknown flies and the Doctor flies. Pretty cool...

Casting: Definitely practice your casting. On the boat, a good guide will do his best to position you for your best shot. But on foot, you're often on your own. Even if you're walking in a favorable direction as far as the wind goes, you'll find that the bones come from all directions. There's nothing like stalking fish in the distance and then finding that there are more behind you, even closer. So now you turn around and have to deal with a 15-20 mph wind in your face. --126-3-

Paul