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Bob Parsons
10-24-2005, 08:05 AM
With a potent storm and then Wilma creating severe Nor'easter conditions, could this be the end of Monomoy? Could the southway fill in sufficiently to be no longer passable? Or perhaps these will be just the few of many winter storms that finish what last year's storms started.

Ray
10-24-2005, 08:28 AM
Bob,

It's anyone's guess. During a meeting last spring with the staff of the refuge we spoke about the southway getting shallower and narrower. They felt that without any significant storms, that area would fill in within 3 years. They also felt the area broken away in the 58' to for Morris Island would attach again.

That being said, I feel it would greatly increase the quality of fishing grounds if the southway filled. The are can be accessed by shallow draft boats like those used by the clamming fleet and avid sight fisherpersons. Access for deeper water boats would be limited at best, but the general area, S. Monomoy and S. Beach, could still be accessed from Nauset and Stage Harbor.

Here's an interesting link about Chatham/Monomoy
http://www.mychatham.com/monomoy.html

Chuckster
10-24-2005, 08:35 AM
Bob,

I wondered that myself, only I guess I'm a bit more optimistic because I was thinking it may open up The Southway...

Do you have any reason to believe it will fill in rather than open up?

It was a little iffy heading through there a few times this past season, even though my boat draws next to nothing. I hope for everyone's sake it will remain passable, I guess only time will tell.

Capt.Sickdog
10-24-2005, 08:39 AM
I have asked her and she said she would not do something so mean..

Ray
10-24-2005, 08:53 AM
Chuck,

A significant NE wind is expected along with the water being blow with it. This would blow across the southern tip of South Beach into the southway.

But as many of have seen in this area. Who knows what will happen. Last spring breach in South Beach surprised most of us.

Ray

Ray
10-24-2005, 09:39 AM
You'd be surprised how well Coyotes can swim. The folks at the refuge said they see Coyotes swim between Morris Island and the Island. When that shallow water freezes over they just walk across. The folks at the refuge also said that is one of the reasons they can't simply move the Coyotes to the mainland. They, or other, would just be back eventually.

Who's to say if the bodies of land connect some other storm or tough winter won't break them apart again. Or even make some other significant beneficial change. Two years ago the entire area froze solid for weeks. The sand moved by this made changes that should have taken several years.

Capt.Sickdog
10-24-2005, 09:41 AM
I see them swimming in the river all the time from bank to bank

Chuckster
10-24-2005, 10:08 AM
Ray,

You make some great points, but I have to wonder about your theory "I feel it would greatly increase the quality of fishing grounds if the southway filled."

Personally, I've think that much of the area has suffered as a result of the reduced flow this year. I've noticed that the stretch between from the U marker out to the narrows had much less active signs of life this year than in years past, which causes me to wonder.

Also, I'm wondering what the effect will be on The Crib if The Southway does shut down. I can only speculate that a Southway closure will increase the flow through The Crib

Again, these are purely my own observations/theories and I'm fully aware and willing to accept that I could be completely wrong.

sage fly guy
10-24-2005, 10:48 AM
Going in an out of the South cut perhaps 30 times this season gives one a good appreciation of what's happening. You begin paying extremely close attention to the tides. From perhaps an hour before low to an hour after on a normal tide it is unpassable as it stands now. Several times we had to get out(damn cold water) and walk the boat over the last bar, with a good 1 1/2 left in the falling tide. Once we went around.

One thing I've noticed is that the flats areas have much less accessible sand for the clammers. If you notice at low tide the clammers are almost right at the waters edge. In years past they would be many 100 yards up on the flats, having worked inshore with the dropping tides.

I have 2 framed 16x20 pics of Monomoy on my dining room wall. One from the 04 season, one from the 01 season, the difference is simply amazing. I'm going to get an updated one from this year, when compared to 01, the difference mother nature has churned up is truly staggering.

As far as the fishing goes, if it did fill in, just go around. I've never been one for fishing inside, but I think you would find many less fish available.

chris

Onshore
10-24-2005, 10:57 AM
My guess is that it that South Beach and Monomoy will be joined by Spring, if not before. It has been amazing the changes there in the southway and the cut in just the past two years.

From that meeting with the refuge staff last Spring and later speaking with their geologist; I don't see any chance of that reversing in the near future.

JAVIDANGLER
10-24-2005, 12:02 PM
Hopefully Wilma will be nice to all our beaches. Duxbury Beach breached every so often.

As for wildlife swiming, water doesn't typically stop them. A number of Deer have crossed Duxbury bay this year.
Coon's, Foxes, Opossums, Coyotes, Skunks and many others have made the Duxbury channel crossing, and there is a lot of current.

Sickdog, great picture of Wilma, Just need one of those Bop-It hammers.

Ray
10-25-2005, 06:53 AM
My theory of the area improving is based on the hope of reduced traffic in the area. I understand the flow will change. Maybe it will increase along Morris Island. And make areas like the Bathtub and south true shallow water sight fishing areas.

bdowning
10-25-2005, 09:03 AM
Skunks swim? Well that explains some of my outings this year...;)

-bd

As for wildlife swiming, water doesn't typically stop them. A number of Deer have crossed Duxbury bay this year.
Coon's, Foxes, Opossums, Coyotes, Skunks and many others have made the Duxbury channel crossing, and there is a lot of current.
.

JAVIDANGLER
10-25-2005, 10:24 AM
Bob,
Apparently they do, Gurnet Saquish and Clark's Island all have skunks. I'd like to know what lures or bait catches them, as I'll be sure not to have any on the boat.

Down in South Florida the bait of chioce for skunks is
bananas. --127-3- Dancing ones I hear are the worst.

Strat
10-25-2005, 10:49 AM
I hope the Southway does not fill in any more but it seems inevitable. My opinion is the (sight) fishing in the refuge was poorer than it has been in years due to the reduced flow coming through the southway.

The water is so skinny at low tide that the fish wont travel through there anymore - especially with the hordes of seals waiting for them in the lagoon just east of the D boy. Combine this with uninitated boaters trying to power through the sand to get out/gettitng stuck and you don't have a very pretty picture.

Chuckster
10-25-2005, 11:12 AM
My sentiments exactly...

Yozuri-Man
10-25-2005, 11:26 AM
I agree with Stat. I think the southway closing may cause temps to get higher in there due to a lack of cool ocean water coming in. Maybe less bass come mid summer, or just a plethora of blues. And the seals are not only everywhere but they seem to be losing there fear of anglers & boats at an alarming rate. Three times this season I had to smack my rod on the water to scare off an approching seal :eek:

jeffsod
10-25-2005, 11:49 AM
It's all part of the 150 year cycle. You cannot stop it and it has happened before which is why they did not plan on dredgeing the southway.

The lack of cool ocean water getting thru to the common flat will hurt sight fishing if the flow gets completely cut off for sure.

sage fly guy
10-25-2005, 04:40 PM
I hope the Southway does not fill in any more but it seems inevitable. My opinion is the (sight) fishing in the refuge was poorer than it has been in years due to the reduced flow coming through the southway.

The water is so skinny at low tide that the fish wont travel through there anymore - especially with the hordes of seals waiting for them in the lagoon just east of the D boy. Combine this with uninitated boaters trying to power through the sand to get out/gettitng stuck and you don't have a very pretty picture.


Although I do little fishing inside, I think you are right. If the South cut fills in the fishing inside will become very poor. I've seen it go from breaking keepers fish right outside Stage 5 years ago, to only minimal schooly/rat blue action this year.

I can recall fishing the tub loaded with big blues and bass. This year the tub was just about empty.

Although perhaps a storm will blow open a new cut, almost did last year. I nice straight shot out would be nice.

chris

chris