Adding a Through Hull Tranducer to a 20' Jones Brothers

[fleshfly]

Anyone out here have any experience on adding a Though Hull Tranducer to a 20' Jones Brothers Cape Fisherman? Look like I'll have to go through, somewhere in the Bilge area. Might be a long shot, but I am curious if anyone has any experience with this? Thanks

[tsheehy]

Have you ruled out a shoot-through-hull transducer?

-- Tom

[ruge13]

Agree with above, I'd look into the shoot through pod if at all possible. Easy instalation.

How skinny do you take that Jones Bros? I wouldn't put a fairing block on a boat meant to go skinny. You are asking for a leak and may be a slave with 5200 to keep your bilge dry.

[z-drive]

if you go through hull, go with an airmar tilted element, very little protrusion.

[Go Fish]

Do an Airmar through hull. They are easy to put in and work really well. Plus you can get everything you need for under $300.

Here is the step by step of my install:

The transducer is a beefy chunk of bronze, the OD of the threads is just under 2 3/8":

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v412/G0Fish/DSC_0228.jpg

First, I had to figure out where to put it. The Airmar instructions give some suggestions but stop short of telling you exactly what to do...assuming liability is not good business. I selected a flat spot that wasn't terribly obstructed and fell within the vague "zone" described in the instructions. The location is eight inches forward of the stern and 7 inches starboard of the keel line.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v412/G0Fish/DSC_0234.jpg

I went through a zillion (or 3) different ways to measure the location inside the hull relative to the outside. It was important to avoid the trailer rollers and stay within the "zone".

I started by drilling a pilot hole from the inside out. It was a bit stressful to be poking a hole in the running surface but I got over it. Chucking up the 2 3/8" hole saw and crawling under the boat is what really got the juices flowing. This is the result:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v412/G0Fish/DSC_0243.jpg

On the inside I faired the hole so that the rubber washer had a flat surface to mate with:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v412/G0Fish/DSC_0242.jpg

This is continued in the next post

[Go Fish]

The instructions suggest a butt load of "adhesive suitable for below waterline use" so I picked 3M 5200 and put it on the flange that mates with the outside of the hull and the threads super thick making sure the threads and sides of the hole were well coated. I used too much and had alot of clean up but there is no question that everything is sealed.

Finished view from the inside:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v412/G0Fish/DSC_0251.jpg

Finished view from the outside:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v412/G0Fish/DSC_0249.jpg

[fleshfly]

Thanks go fish!!!! that actually looks like the one I was thinking, but wasn't 100% about my location, and how do I determine if I get the 12% or 20% off set to compensate for angle of my hull at the location of the tranducer.

[Go Fish]

The angle of the ducer is based on the deadrise of your hull. Call up John at Voyager Marine Electronics in Essex and tell him what you want to do. He set me up and actually convinced me that the install was easy enough that I didn't need to pay him another $250 to put it in.

[z-drive]

i used the super handy-dandy level app for the iphone/touch and mine was right in the middle, so i wen't with a 20 degree unit. even if its off by 5 degrees in 200' of water thats something only like a 17' offset which i can live with.

i am installing mine a little farther foward as there is already a hole there from the old ducer. my hull also has a ducer pocket back aft for one that would normally require the use of a fairing block but there really aren't any on the market in my price range for my unit, so with the airmar i went. going to be sticking it in later this week upon a slight enlargement of the hole in my hull.

when i install through hulls of all sorts i have been making lexan or teflon "washers" to put between the hull and retaining nut, simmilar to the rubber washer that comes with the airmars. this helps keep the adhesive away from the threads within the nut and gives a little more room for a better bead of gooop. if you have a cored hull (i dont know about the jbs) but then you have to do a little more involved of an install.

here's a pic of the "washer" thing on a through-hull pickup install.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a14/suppys/SL371721.jpg

[ruge13]

Yep, I definately should have asked what type of through hull before I said anything:rolleyes:... I forget most of the TH's I'm used to are a bit larger and need High speed fairing blocks. 5200 is your friend for sure. Nice pics/description of the install.

[SamRiley]

I'm running an Airmar P79 shoot through on my Parker 1801. Why drill if you don't have to? No offense to those who chose otherwise but the last thing that I need in my life is one more maintenance item on the check list. I can hold bottom at 30mph and mark fish at cruise.

[pogiefisher]

get a drill and make a hole buy some 5200 and get a through hull fitting... hopefully you have a radio and seatow.

[Redfisher]

Thanks go fish!!!! that actually looks like the one I was thinking, but wasn't 100% about my location, and how do I determine if I get the 12% or 20% off set to compensate for angle of my hull at the location of the tranducer.

Fleshfly

I just put a deposit on a JB 20' Cape Fisherman and have ordered a B60 transducer for a Furuno 620. The boat has 14 degrees of deadrise so the correct model is the 12 degree transducer. The 12 degree model covers boats with 8 to 15 degrees of deadrise per the Airmar specs.

On my prior boat I had a shoot thru the hull model which read perfectly up to my max speed of 43 MPH. But I want to get the best readings possible for finding fish so decided to go with a thru hull.

Good luck.
Dan

[Go Fish]

get a drill and make a hole buy some 5200 and get a through hull fitting... hopefully you have a radio and seatow.

Yup. I have both.

And an extra radio to boot.

More importantlly I, and those who care to take on the tasks, have the peace of mind that modifications to our rides have been done by concerned and qualified individuals.

Go foul hook some bait and leave our thread alone.

[RogerStg]

I'm running an Airmar P79 shoot through on my Parker 1801. Why drill if you don't have to? No offense to those who chose otherwise but the last thing that I need in my life is one more maintenance item on the check list. I can hold bottom at 30mph and mark fish at cruise.

Water temperature is important to some of us. ;)

[z-drive]

Water temperature is important to some of us. ;)

yes. i was thinking the same thing. better than the alternative of installing a seperate unit just for temp (and usually waterspeed). then you still need a hole in the hull. in hull is the way to go if you're all about reading at speed but if you want seriously clear picture the through hulls the only way.

no need to go nuts swith 5200 either, that is if you ever plan on removing it. keep it to the bottom flange and just a little on the threads that go through the hull. when you remove one that was held in by a whole tube of 10 year old 5200 you'll understand.

[fleshfly]

Thanks for all the input. Hey Dan, Congrats on the new ride! , my boat is still in storage, and your input is very helpful. I have the same sonar, and looking forward to the new tranducer.

[Redfisher]

Fleshfly

If you still have questions call Jones Brothers at (253) 240-1995. They will be happy to give you answers.

I had a question on one of thier options so I called and left a message on their answering machine ( usually there is no one in the office). Donnie Jones, the owner, called back and spent twenty minutes explaining things to me and that evening sent me two emails with pictures to make sure I had the information needed to make my decision.

Dan

[fleshfly]

Yes, Donnie is a great guy. He has helped a ton with my questions when I was looking at the boat, and still always responds right back to me via email. I have had the boat now for 2 years. Their service is great.

[z-drive]

did you ever decide on radar?

[fleshfly]

I am pretty sure I am going to go with the FURUNO 1623, it is their smallest radar, with 13 range scales from .125-16NM. basic 6" high contrast sliver N black lcd. nothing crazy, but it looks like it will suit my needs and budget well. I lurked around with a few dealers, and even met some of the reps, of various MFGS, at an open house at a local dealer. all pointed me this way. Just need to make a decision by the end of the week....any ideas?

[z-drive]

you can't go wrong with furuno. those little monochrome lcd units are workhorses. i have the older version, the 1621.

[Albiemanmike]

I have been wrestling with much of this myself recently. I bought Kevin's radar mount last year and never had the chance to use it as I did not have radar yet. Well now this year I can get my radar and I have been battling with which direction to go with all of this. There are a ton of options available and all of them have great functionality but my biggest thing is performance and reliability. After much research and reading i decided on the Furuno 1824C/NT VX2 radar w/18" radome, the DFF1 Black Box sounder and an M260 in hull transducer. When trying to decide on the transducer I asked Airmar a bunch of questions and the lady I spoke with told me the M260 was hands down the better unit even though it shoots through the hull.

Here is what she said:

"The transducers are quite different with respect to the ceramics used to construct them. The B164 has a three element triangular pack consisting of three dual frequency 50/200kHz ceramics. The M260 has 8 elements. One very large 200kHz broadband ceramic and seven 50kHz ceramics in a circular pack. The quality of the ceramics used to build the M260 are better. The M260 model is capable of higher resolution than the B164 who is a close second."

So I decided on the in hull instead of cutting a hole in the hull. If i don't need to cut then why cut? Now I just have to order up the gear and put it in. I already installed the Sea Star Hydraulic steering earlier this month so after the electronics is in the boat should be good to go.

[Joe Hale]

I'm pretty serious about going tilted element, too.

Using a P66 Transom Mount now, I emailed Airmar asking if the B60 was a good upgrade, but I could put a 1 kW on my fishfinder, kind of thinking about that B164 complete with 3-3/4" hole. No response from Airmar, but then only emailed them like yesterday.

Anybody willing to talk about quality of 600 watt transom mount versus 600 watt tilted element versus 1000 watt tilted element? Hole size from 2-3/8" to 3-3/4" for the B60 to the B164 - seems to me it had better be a hell of a lot better.

BTW - the speed off my P66 was never accurate, proven by GPS. I figure I don't need speed anymore off that, even though trip odometer is my main gas tank - GPS trip odometer seems to work as well, GPS speed does just fine. Any you guys out there worried about getting a paddlewheel, if you have GPS you shouldn't need it. Also, both B60 and B164 come with temperature.

I guess I had better look at the M260, too.

[ruge13]

Do you mean B260?

[riptide]

Guys you can have it all! I went with the M260 in the hull (shoot thru) AND a speed/temp sensor. The ST sensor mounts on the transom like a regular el cheapo ducer does, but it only does S&T. A "Y" cable adaptor connects the S?T to the M260 and runs it all into the sounder. We can keep bottom @ WOT and still get great S&T. Its a little more work than a regular all in one ducer, but no big holes in the hull (just 2 small screw holes to mount the S/T. IMHO its the best of all worlds. I have the same setup on my Hydra Sports. For less $$$, Sam's P79 w/ a separate S/T is a nice option. I installed one on Dana's Hydra Sports. He holds bottom @ 40kts no issues.

[Joe Hale]

Yep, I meant M260, shoot-thru like Capt. Terry talks about above. It takes a 9"x6" spot on the hull bottom - sounds like I'll be chopping out a lot of foam. I have heard that it is good.

Now, a TM258 shows up (checking compatibility with my older DSM250 with Raymarine) that is a 1 kW transom mount. No hole and performance, too!

Still shopping.